Tom chats with John Laird, who has spent the past 40 years trying to build an AI agent that accomplishes the full range of human cognitive abilities, beginning with his 1980s PhD research on the SOAR model of human cognition with Allen Newell and Paul Rosenbloom. John E. Laird received his Ph.D. from Carnegie Mellon University in 1985, and is John L. Tishman Emeritus Professor of Engineering at the University of Michigan. He is one of the original developers of the SOAR architecture and leads its continued development and evolution. He was a founder of Soar Technology. He is a AAAI, ACM, AAAS, and Cognitive Science Society Fellow. In 2018, he was co-winner of the Herbert A. Simon Prize for Advances in Cognitive Systems.